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AustinQ

I have emailed my cousin and asked her to have a look through the stuff she found that her Dad started, and she will let me know if she finds anything. There may not be much as he was doing his own side of the family, but I hear what you say, that any little snippett will help. Its my cousins Mum, (Doreen Crosby nee Lynn) now passed, who was grandaughter to Mary Lynn.

I will be in and out today and this evening, but am keeping an eye on this thread as and when I can.

Just found another child of James White and Mary Young- finally, a son!:

Birth: 31 July 1881
Name: Joseph White
ABode: Stiles, Antrim
Father: James WHite (Labourer)
Mother: Mary White (formerly Young)
Informant: Martha Fletcher, Hungry Hall (Present at birth)

EDIT: Sorry Erin, just seen your post. Yes, we spend far too much time chasing the dead, but it keeps us out of mischief :)

Thats fantastic !!

(lol, hope you didn't mind Egb, pulling you away from those 'Jays' of yours!, wouldn't normally be so cheeky!)

Chris :)

Thankyou for adding that AQ, adding up gradually, lol, anything on that 1875 Hercules Death about?...(wondered if it was him!)

(have to go out shortly (moans!) will look in later)

Unfortunately I can't see the image for the 1875 Hercules death- but it seems likely it's him.

Just wish we could find that tiny thread that would definitely tie Deborah's Mary to this family- perhaps her name as a witness to a marriage, or an informant on a death certificate. The whole family are proving a little hard to locate.

I did wonder if this was Mary's death (Wife of James)

Death: 20 June 1889
Name: Mary White (Married - wife of James White, labourer)
Place of death: Church Street, Antrim
Cause: Abdominal Cancer 5 months
Informant: ?nie White (Possibly Annie- although not sure), daughter, Church Street, Antrim, present at death.

This is Joseph in 1911- he married Harriet Ware Cummings in 1906, West Derby- (I can't see original certificate) he also had a middle name added that wasn't on his birth certificate- Young (obviously taken from his mother):

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
56 Winslow St Walton Liverpool, Walton on the Hill, Lancashire, England

Joseph White Head Married Male 29 1882 Antrim Parish Co Antrim Resident Coal Heaver Sugar Refinery
Harriet White Wife Married Female 33 1878 Liverpool Toxteth -
Ruth White Daughter - Female 1 1910 Liverpool Kirkdale
----------------------------

Just to confirm it is him- (Matching birth date, one year out),

1939 register:

Household (1 Person) Certified Institution, Y M C A Hostel Village Road, Whetston Lane , Birkenhead C.B., Cheshire, England
Joseph Y White Inmate 31 Jul 1882 Male Fruit Broker Married
----------------------------

He died in 1966 Cheshire

I think the above death is correct for Mary (wife of James)- I think the first daughter born in 1872 (unnamed at registration) was Annie.

I think Annie married in 1895- her sister Sarah was one of the witnesses:

Marriage: St Anne's, Parish of Belfast
Date: 25 November 1895

Name: James Campbell (28, Bachelor, Butcher)
Father: James Campbell (Soldier)
Abode: 35 Israel Street, Belfast

Spouse: Annie White (23, Spinster)
Father: James White ( Labourer)
Abode: 67 Sylvio Street, Belfast

Witnesses: Sara White & Robert Gamble
---------------------------------------

This is them in 1911:

Ireland Census 1911 Transcription
Residents of a house 5 in Howe Street (Shankill, Antrim)
James Campbell Campbell Head of Family Married 46 1865 Brtaltown, Co Armagh
Annie Young Campbell Wife Married 39 1872 Co Antrim
Mabel White Campbell Daughter Single 16 1895 Belfast
Annie Campbell Daughter Single 13 1898 Belfast
John Campbell Son Single 10 1901 Belfast
Sarah Josephine Campbell Daughter Single 8 1903 Belfast
William Campbell Son Single 6 1905 Belfast
David Eric Campbell Son Single 3 1908 Belfast
Bute Jas Kathleen Campbell Daughter Single 0 1911 Belfast
-------------------------------

And with her father in 1901:

Residents of a house 52 in Emerson Street (Shankhill, Antrim)

James Campbell Head of Family Married 35 1866 Armagh
Annie Campbell Wife Married 28 1873 Armagh
James Campbell Son Single 7 1894 Belfast
John Campbell Son Single 3 1898 Belfast
Isabella Campbell Daughter Single 10 1891 Belfast
Maggie Campbell Daughter Single 8 1893 Belfast
Annie Campbell Daughter Single 5 1896 Belfast
Mable Campbell Daughter Single 6mnths Belfast
James White Father in Law Widowed 48 1853 Antrim

(the children born before 1895 were James Campbell's children from a previous marriage)
----------------------------------

This may be a red herring but;

Census of Ireland 1911
7 Coopers Lane, Larne

Mary Campbell
Patrick Campbell
William Lynn - my great grandfather
John Campbell Lester Lynn - my grandfather

Census of Ireland 1901

7 Curran Street, Larne

John Lynn
Margrate/Margaret Lynn
William Lynn
Mary Lynn
John Campbell Lester Lynn
Mary Campbell

The Campbells are our family,

John Lynn and Margaret Lynn nee Campbell are my great great grandparents

Missed off the address on my first posting, have just added it.

I have been noting down the names that you are posting, and putting them into Ansestry.com. because I have my DNA registered there, along with my parents DNA, and I have found a lady called Lynne, who lives in Canada, and both me and my Father have a DNA match with her.

I only mention it because she has the following in her tree;

Jane Sinclair, Birth 1794, Loughall, Amagh, Death 19 Feb 1870 Ballmagerny.

Husband James Orr 1784-1870

Children Joseph Orr 1833-1907
Margaret Orr 1840-1907
Martha Orr 1843- ?

According to the records, she was 39, 46 and 49 respectively when she had the children. If you believe any of it, but it was the Sinclair/Orr part together with the DNA matches that caught my attention.

My cousin said that her Mum told her we have family by the name of White living in Queensland, my cousin thinks they are connected to the Campbells, maybe they are in view of what you have found. A skeleton maybe!!

Also, and again, if you can believe it (as I prefer to do my own research, and certificates etc) I did a search on John Alexander Sinclair 1878-1954 and a Tara Sharp came up with him in her tree. (no DNA matches though this time) but according to her J A Sinclair was married twice.

Matilda Sinclair 8 Sep 1883 to Dec 1971 born in Belfast, died in Liverpool.

Marriage 16 Aug 1906- Liverpool

Children,
Gertrude May Sinclair 1908-?
Edna Alexandra Sinclair 1911-?
Norman Alexander Sinclair 1914-1944

2nd marriage to;

Gertrude Mabel Sinclair 16th Apr 1882 West Derby to
12 dec 1951 33 Kent Ave, Litherland, Lancs.

Children;

John Adrian Sinclair 1913-1992
Gertrude Mary Sinclair 1915-1983

I really dont take anything for gospel from Ancestry.com because people just seem to copy incorrect information, but the way the DNA works is very good.

John Alexander SInclair didn't marry again- this is his Probate:

SINCLAIR John Alexander of Devonfield Road, Liverpool 9 died 20 June 1954 Probate 22 July to Matilda Orr Sinclair widow.

It seems they have mixed their information with another John Sinclair.

When I saw her tree, I thought that, she has far too much detail, usually a sign its copied, but thought it worth a mention.

Have just edited my previous post, I thought my cousin said the Whites were in Canada, its Queensland. Sorry about that.

I get the impression that they never knew who they were though.

Glad to hear you do your own Primary Source Research.....!!! I have been cautioning people for years about copying other peoples trees or taking info.from them that cannot be verified.
I have for the first time had access to trees on Ancestry and found my great grandfather married to a complete stranger in another part of the UK he is also buried with this woman...Not true..
A tree for my daughter-in- law's family has her maternal grandmother as someone completely different..on and on and on....

Private
SINCLAIR, NORMAN ALEXANDER
Service Number 7381549

Died 16/07/1944

Aged 30

23 Lt. Field Amb
Royal Army Medical Corps

Son of John Alexander Sinclair and Matilda Orr Sinclair; husband of Dorothy Lucy Sinclair, of Torquay, Devon.

Lol. Proves the point though. Dont think much of Ancestry but the DNA bit is good. I found 2 cousins who I have made contact with, which has been nice.

Actually, thats probably not fair, its the way people use Ancestry that gives it a bad name,

Am going out shortly for the evening, but want to say it again, I am so grateful for what you are doing, we were going to give up.

Having said that, there are probably loads of Mary Lynns/White that I could have 'copied' from Ancestry trees, LOL.

Will....

Norman Alexander Sinclair of 37 Devonfield Rd Liverpool 9.
Died 18 July 1944 on War Service.
Probate Liverpool 4th January 1945 to John Alexander Sinclair. Censorship Examiner. £165.7s.3d

(adds below)

Chris :)

07 August 1944 - Liverpool Evening Express - Liverpool, Merseyside,

Private Norman Alexander Sinclair. R.A.M.C., husband of Mrs. Dorothy Sinclair, St Paul’s street, Southport, and Orrell Park, has died from wounds. A Liverpool man, he was educated at Alsop High School.


Edits

(there also 1910)

Howe Street
9. Campbell, Jas., butcher

(quite a few of James White)

http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/alphanames1910TUVWXYZ.htm#W


(think I came across this website for Belfast some time ago, on another query)

http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/index.htm

(seeing reference 1911, Coopers Lane, Larne (Campbell) wonder if below related somewhere...

Chris :)

14 July 1928 - Larne Times - Larne, Antrim, Northern Ireland

Mrs. Mary Wilkinson summoned Mrs. Teresa Campbell (for whom Mr. M’Ninch appeared) for using threats and there was a cross-summons. The parties live in Cooper’s Lane, Larne. . Mrs Wilkinson volubly recited grievance, that Mrs. Campbell had threatened her and had thrown a jug of water over her...

(both women were advised by the Chairman to go home and not interfere with other in future)


1911 (Irish Census)
Residents of a house 3 in Coopers Lane (Larne, Antrim)
Wilkinson Edward 51 Male Head of Family Presbyterian Antrim Fisher Man Read and write - Married - 10 - -
Wilkinson Mary 43 Female Wife R C Antrim - Read and Write - Married - 10 years
Hamil George 27 Male Son R C Antrim Labourer General Read and Write -

(Maiden name Watson for Mary)


29 April 1916 - Larne Times - Larne, Antrim, Northern Ireland

Mary Campbell and Mary Ramsey (mother and daughter), of Cooper’s Lane, were charged with a breach of the Defence of the Realm Regulations—that they did give, sell dink to a naval man named green...


(notes a 1905 Marriage, Mary Campbell to George Ramsey, Antrim, if they related at all!)


28 October 1933 - Larne Times - Larne, Antrim, Northern Ireland

Patrick Campbell. Cooper’s Iane. was fined 7s 6d and costs. Sergnt. Sterritt said had to take Campbell to the barracks. Mr. M'Ninch, who admitted the offence on defendant’s behalf said that was the first case against Campbell in ten years.


29 June 1918 - Larne Times - Larne, Antrim, Northern Ireland

Wounded.
Campbell Patrick, Private 10th? Labour Co. wounded Ypres 7th December 1917 (Mrs. M. Campbell 14, Coopers Lane)

With reference to the above. We did wonder if there were 2 Mary Campbells in the family because when we looked closer at the 2 census's we noticed this;

1901 7 Curran Street

Mary Campbell age 35, sister in law to our GG Grandfather John Lynn- presbytarian

1911 7 Coopers lane

Mary Campbell age 55 living with her son Patrick Campbell- Roman Catholic
The other 2 are my Grandfather and great grandfather.

We had assumed that there was only one Mary Campbell who was the sister to Margaret Lynn nee Campbell, our GG Grandmother.

(is there anywhere you can see anything 'Electoral' wise, might give more of an idea who is who at 'Coopers Lane', over the years?...(seems to be popular, Campbell, and looks like they need 'sortin' also!)

Think you need a holiday spent in the Archives!, lol...(they usually offer a Research service, if not too expensive!)

Chris :)