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Could anyone help or will this just be a dead end. I haven't come across this problem before so am unsure if there are any other searches I can try. I have been looking at siblings of relatives while waiting for some certificates to arriveand came across this lady/girl -

Olive Seale -
Both parents appear to have died - Mother 1870 and Father 1873 (Just waiting death certificates)

She appears on the 1871 Census with her father Thomas at Chapel Street Weobley. Age 8 months so born 1870 in Weobley Herefordshire.

I have found a probable birth - unfortunately GRO is not showing it (Reported) but as yet cannot see the MMN
Name: Olive Seale
Registration Year: 1870
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Weobley
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume: 6a
Page: 505

This is all the info I can find regarding this child - I wonder what would usually happen where both parents had died and left a very young child? She is not with the other siblings that I have so far found. I have tried searching GRO for additional siblings that might not have been on the census but have not had much luck at all with this. Mother was Ann Palmer.

Other siblings -
- William Henry Seale can be found in 1881 Broomfield Farm Lancashire and is listed as nephew to Samuel Davies or Martha M - not linked these in the tree yet waiting for available certificates for parents (Death and marriage) baptisms not found)
- Anne Elizabeth Seale can be found living next door to William at Broomfield House listed as a visitor to Mary Fisher and Sarah Baker - - not linked these in the tree (If they are related at all) yet waiting for available certificates for parents (Death and marriage) baptisms not found)
- Mary Ann Seale - also a mystery as birth would seem to be pre parents marriage and not tracked this birth down yet. By 1881 I would assume would be married. Possible marriage in 1872 Herefordshire. She is on the 1861 census Hereford Street Age 9 - 1852 with both Thomas and Ann listed as parents and she has the surname Seale.

Anyway not 100% sure exactly what I am asking or hoping to find but any pointers would be great.
Thanks for any help

Have you considered that she could be Mary’s child?

Mary is aged 21 on 1871 census

Thomas was married previously - in 1849, so Mary could be a child of that union. Censuses record relationships to the HEAD. A man’s wife is not necessarily the mother of all, or any, of the children living with them

Name: Mary Underwood
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 11 Nov 1849
Marriage Place: Kings Pyon,Hereford,England
Spouse: Thomas Leale


SEALE, MARY 24
GRO Reference: 1853 D Quarter in WEOBLEY Volume 06A Page 301

He married Palmer in 1858

Mary Ann Seal (no final e) was registered in Dec qtr 1851 in Weobley district. A bit late if her age in 1871 was accurate , but fits with 1861 age

SEAL, MARY ANN UNDERWOOD
GRO Reference: 1851 D Quarter in OF WEOBLEY Volume 26 Page 239

1871
Name: Oline Seale
Age: 8 Months
Estimated birth year: abt 1870
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: Thomas Seale
Gender: Female
Where born: Weobley, Herefordshire, England
Civil Parish: Weobley
Town: Weobley
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Weobley
Sub-registration district: Weobley
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Household schedule number: 92
Piece: 2705
Folio: 17
Page Number: 14
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Seale 45
Mary A Seale 21
Annie E Seale 7
William Hy Seale 3
Oline Seale 8 Months

Name: Olive Seale
Registration Year: 1870
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Weobley
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume: 6a
Page: 505

Someone by the name of Cathy posted a correction to the 1871 census on Ancestry - she may be connected

A male with a tree on there has Olive's birth and 1871, but nothing else about her

maddie's post confirms the info given by the OP

SEALE, ANNE ELIZABETH PALMER
GRO Reference: 1864 M Quarter in WEOBLEY Volume 06A Page 533

SEALE, WILLIAM HENRY PALMER
GRO Reference: 1868 S Quarter in WEOBLEY Volume 06A Page 489

Same vol, page quarter:

Name: Olive Hoome
Registration Year: 1870
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Weobley
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume: 6a
Page: 505

1851

Name: Thomas Seal
Age: 24
Estimated birth year: abt 1827
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Mary Seal
Gender: Male
Where born: Orleton, Herefordshire, England
Civil Parish: Kings Pyon
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Weobly
Sub-registration district: Weobly
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 79
Piece: 1979
Folio: 351
Page Number: 20
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Seal 24
Mary Seal 21
Geo Seal 4
Thomas Seal 1*********************in 1861 living with a couple named Davies

1861

Name: Thomas Seale
Age: 11
Estimated birth year: 1850
Relation: Nephew
Gender: Male
Where born: Kings Pion, Herefordshire, England
Civil Parish: Dilwyn
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Weobly
Sub-registration district: Dilwyn
ED, institution, or vessel: 2a
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 39
Piece: 1826
Folio: 21
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name Age
James Davies 37 born Leominster
Fanney Davies 40 born Weobley
Thomas Seale 11

Re Samuel and Martha M Davies in the 1881 census:

??
Marriages Mar 1875 (>99%)
DAVIES Samuel Hereford 6a 723
HARVEY Martha Maria Hereford 6a 723


For our reference:

Samuel Davies
in the 1881 England Census
Name: Samuel Davies
Age: 25
Estimated birth year: abt 1856
Relationship to Head: Head
Spouse: Martha M. Davies
Gender: Male
Where born: Condors, Shropshire, England [ Condover ]
Civil Parish: Standish with Langtree
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address: Broomfield Farm
Marital status: Married
Occupation: Farmer (Of 16 Acres) & Railway Servant
Registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Neighbors:
Piece: 3758
Folio: 100
Page Number: 12
Household Members:
Name Age
Samuel Davies 25
Martha M. Davies 36 - Aystree, Hereford [ Aymestrey ?? ]
William H. Seale 12

1861

Name: George Seal
Age: 14
Estimated birth year: 1847
Relation: Servant
Gender: Male
Where born: Weobley, Herefordshire, England
Civil Parish: Dilwyn
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Weobly
Sub-registration district: Dilwyn
ED, institution, or vessel: 2a
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 30
Piece: 1826
Folio: 20
Page Number: 7
Household Members:
Name Age
George Pitt 41
Mary Ann Pitt 43
Elmina Dinna Pitt 24
Mary Jancey 23
Ann Badham 17
George Wainrick 22
William Davies 22
Septimus Abley 16
George Seal 14 born Weobley

Baptism of the Thomas Seale in the 1861 census:

Thomas Seale
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Thomas Seale
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 3 Feb 1850
Baptism Place: Kings Pyon,Hereford,England
Father: Thomas Seale
Mother: Mary
FHL Film Number: 942257


SCALE, THOMAS mms UNDERWOOD
GRO Reference: 1850 M Quarter in OF WEOBLEY Volume 26 Page 225

UNDERWOOD, GEORGE -
GRO Reference: 1846 D Quarter in OF WEOBLEY Volume 26 Page 245

Illegitimate - borne out by baptism

Name: George Underwood
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 7 Mar 1847
Baptism Place: Kings Pyon,Hereford,England
Mother: Mary Underwood

Hi all, Thanks. I think I might have got a bit lost -

Ok so in summary I think I understand the following -

ErikaH - I hadn't thought about Olive being Mary's child but there is still no sign of her after the 1871 census.
- I had thought about a first marriage for Thomas but then forgot about this but i would have thought highly probable - I am waiting for his marriage certificate to Ann Palmer which might confirm second marriage.
- Cathy on ancestry n- I think would be my tree and I have added a couple of transcription errors here an there
- I think the other tree is by someone with Seale in their username? I have spoken briefly to him and we have confirmed we are related but that is about it at the mo and don't think he has any more info on Olive unfortunately

in terms of the others siblings GRO info -
Anne - I had found the same GRO birth but not confirmed with a certificate
William Henry Seale - I have this birth certificate and death certificate and parish marriage info

Then I get a bit lost -
I think you are all saying -
Thomas was married first to Mary Underwood and they have children Thomas and George (Possibly but possibly illegitimate) and that this pair might be the parents of Mary Ann Seale?

But there is no sign of Olive post 1871?

Thanks
Sue

P.S on the 1871 Census it is difficult ro read but possibly lists Mary Ann Seale born Kings Pyon

???

DAVIES, SAMUEL mms PRICE
GRO Reference: 1855 D Quarter in WEOBLEY Volume 06A Page 409

or this one ??

DAVIES, SAMUEL -
GRO Reference: 1852 S Quarter in LEOMINSTER Volume 06A Page 454



Floundering, looking for links:

???

Martha Harry [ Harvy, I think ]
in the 1871 England Census
Name: Martha Harry
Age: 29
Estimated birth year: abt 1842
Relation: Stepdaughter
Mother's name: Elizabeth Bridgwaters
Gender: Female
Where born: Abby Misley, Herefordshire, England [ Aymestrey ]
Civil Parish: Luston
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Leominster
Sub-registration district: Kingsland
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Household schedule number: 116
Piece: 2718
Folio: 59
Page Number: 18
Household Members:
Name Age
Edward Bridgwaters 70
Elizabeth Bridgwaters 61
Martha Harry 29 - dressmaker, married


1881 census (previously posted) says Martha M Davies, Samuel's wife, was born "Aystree" (Aymestrey).


Wrong reg district, and wrong middle initial - but will post in case:

???
PALMER, MARTHA ELIZABETH -
GRO Reference: 1841 J Quarter in PRESTEIGNE & KINGTON Volume 26 Page 259



???
Edward Bridgewaters
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Marriage Index, 1837-1915
Name: Edward Bridgewaters
Registration Year: 1866
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration district: Leominster
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume: 6a
Page: 1084
Records on Page:
Name
Edward Bridgewaters
Elizabeth Palmer <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Sorry if I am repeating, I may have missed it


First name(s) MARY ANN
Last name SEAL
Birth year 1851
Birth quarter 4
Registration month -
Mother's maiden name Underwood
District Weobley
County Herefordshire
Country England
Volume XXVI
Page 239

On the other hand (following on from my last post ), there's this - don't know if connected or not -

Marriages Dec 1867 (>99%)
BARKER Edmund Leominster 6a 1123
DAVIES Charles Leominster 6a 1123
DAVIS Charles Leominster 6a 1123
DEARN Betsy Butler Leominster 6a 1123
Palmer Martha Maria Leominster 6a 1123 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<