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Army Womens Death.

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

~~~Secret Red ^^ Squirrel~~~  **007 1/2**

~~~Secret Red ^^ Squirrel~~~ **007 1/2** Report 20 Jun 2008 20:56

Hi Kathryn, I'll take note and I'll remember not to refer to you as a lady in future. :-) I tend to refer to men and women as ladies and gentlemen quite a lot 'in the real world' as it sounds politer in certain sentences (in my opinion of course) however, I perfectly understand if you do not want to be defined by this term.

Strangely enough I did wonder whether you would pick me up on this, I should have gone with my gut instincts and omitted it. :-)

I think I have a different definition of bad manners than you so I'll agree to disagree in this instance.

To be honest I agree with you in this issue that women should have the choice to go to war if they wish (although personally I prefer peace) however, I appreciate that people have other views that differ than mine in so many areas.

However, I still think there is a way to voice a difference in opinion without personally offending the other person on the other side of the debate.

Cumbrian Caz~**~

Cumbrian Caz~**~ Report 20 Jun 2008 21:02

Thankyou Lesley,
I expressed my opinion politely and without malice,

Caz xx


Dermot Report 20 Jun 2008 21:21

Informed & intelligent conversation is the highest sport of civilisation.

Have we learned anything new from these postings?

Cumbrian Caz~**~

Cumbrian Caz~**~ Report 20 Jun 2008 21:24

Hello Dermot,

I dont know, but we all have a right to opinions,

Right or wrong, i wish all service personnel Gods speed,

Caz x

~~~Secret Red ^^ Squirrel~~~  **007 1/2**

~~~Secret Red ^^ Squirrel~~~ **007 1/2** Report 20 Jun 2008 21:45

Hi Caz,

I do think there has to be a degree of responsibility with Free Speech and I don't believe that people should post/say absolutely anything without regard for others just because they can or because they have the right. I do think if people post something extreme then they should expect it to be challenged or if it is completely inappropriate for it to be deleted by GR.

However, I do think there are certain issues that make a good debate and I believe that people can remain on friendly terms even though they disagree on certain issues.

However, perhaps that is another debate altogether. :-)

Cumbrian Caz~**~

Cumbrian Caz~**~ Report 20 Jun 2008 21:50

I agree lesley,

In a free world, which weall want, we may have differing opinions,

In the words of someone whose name evades me ' i will fight for your right to your opinion, even though i may not agree with it'

The free west lets all of us have an opinion, whilst respecting others,

Caz x

Small blonde Angel

Small blonde Angel Report 20 Jun 2008 21:51

I was an army wife and follwed the drum. I have worked for the military in the past and felt the bias that some in the military can have towards women however, I have no real argument to offer as to whether they should be in the front line. As the front line is a flexible thing, both my husbands did trades in the army which a woman could and did do just as well. There were sexual tensions between the sexes and my first husband had one of his many affairs with a woman who was on surviellence with him for long hours in a car. But that can apply to members of the Police etc. So I would not want to disapprove of women in any profession due to sex.
As I am an equality officer within a group I belong to I very much believe in the rights of the individual, and that everyone has equal rights.
I agree that every death of every person is a huge loss and I grieve for their friends and family.

One of the foundations of my whole belief system is that everyone has the right to their opinion and also has the right to express it. 'I may disagree totally with your opinion but I will defend to the death your right to express it.' To do otherwise would mean that I believe in dictatorship which I don't.
Now before anyone has a go at me I am not getting at anyone at all. Just saying that however much I disagree with anyone I will respect their right to express their opinion.
Love and respect to everyone and my sincere thoughts and condolances to the families of all bereaved around the country.


Cumbrian Caz~**~

Cumbrian Caz~**~ Report 20 Jun 2008 21:53

Thankyou Angela,

I agree totally,

Caz xx

ஐ+*¨^¨*+e+*¨^¨*+ஐ Mildred Honkinbottom

ஐ+*¨^¨*+e+*¨^¨*+ஐ Mildred Honkinbottom Report 20 Jun 2008 23:30

I personally find its rather crass to blame your work colleagues for being a hindrance just because they are female.

It smacks of sexism.

I pity female soldiers entering in that type of environment.


JaneyCanuck Report 21 Jun 2008 00:02

I was wondering whether I suggested somewhere that Caz or anyone else should be imprisoned for expressing an opinion I find obnoxious.

So I checked, and I don't think I did.

So I'll just keep wondering what the point of this meta-discussion about rights to do this and that is all about.

It is my opinion that people who would deny opportunities to women that are open to men are disrespectful.

I guess somebody just has a problem with me expressing my opinion.

If one doesn't want one's opinion to be challenged, one might consider keeping it to one's self.


Onwe Report 21 Jun 2008 00:46

This thread seems to have sparked a bit of tension.
Sorry for that.

I'n all walks of life, cultures, trades and class, you will get very disagreeable people and people doing the right think.

I no from first had experience men and women can both serve on the front line and behind to their own ability.

Blonde angel I am sorry your first OH went a stray, hope every thing is good now. He was probably a bad sort. I have been in the same position working very closely with men, in verying circumstances and not once did it cross my mind to mess around. I suppose i am too wrapped up in my OH and have been for 26 years.

The arguement i put forward was given to me by a seasoned officer, who was not at all chauvernistic.

To all still serving "may your god go with you and keep you well"


Dermot Report 21 Jun 2008 11:17

Not your fault Sparrow.

Some of us have suffered similar 'personal attacks' previously. Those who know all the answers probably misunderstands the questions in the first place.

Jean Durant

Jean Durant Report 21 Jun 2008 11:34


I resent your post below mine on this thread.
Just because we don't all follow the herd doesn't mean we are making personal attacks. It just means that our views differ from some on this thread.

Surely we are all entitled to a view whether you agree with it or not and to say the question was misunderstood is not correct.

OK the thread deviates from the original posting at times but surely this happens with any debate.



Dermot Report 21 Jun 2008 14:07

The last words in any argument should be - "I expect you are right". (My mother's advice).

Small blonde Angel

Small blonde Angel Report 21 Jun 2008 14:09

Can I just say that all opinions should be welcome and nobody should ever be told not to have them, I love debate and like to hear what peeps have to say and believe in equal rights to all people all the time.


Dermot Report 21 Jun 2008 14:33

Angel - agreed. It is not best that we should all think alike.

The English language has been given to us to make our meaning clear & not wrap it in dishonest doubt. May we all be able to use it so.


°o.O(¯`·._.·Frankie·._.·´¯)O.o° Report 21 Jun 2008 14:36

Hi Sparrow
I agree with the people who have said it's sad but no sadder than the loss of those who died with her & I think it's a shame it's being made such a big thing of. I'm sure she'd rather be remembered as a soldier who died with her comrades & equal to them instead of as the first woman. It's a bit insulting to her memory in a way.
I think its a bit insulting to all the service people for people to say that women shouldn't serve in the frontline because of sexual tension and so on. The majority of servicemen and women are far more dedicated and professional than that & given that gay people also serve its a bit irrelevant.


PinkDiana Report 21 Jun 2008 16:50

I think the point made earlier that the 1st man to die in Afghanistan got press coverage.... so why shouldn't the 1st woman!!

Plus lets be honest workplace affairs happen all the time..... whether in the army or not..... but we wouldn't always blame the woman for starting it by working there would we?

Every soldier that dies has a right to being headline news whether they are male or female!

And Saints Alive..... my ex husband had mood swings that could rival 105 females on their monthly cycle!! So I am cyber slapping you for that comment!! ;o)


Dermot Report 21 Jun 2008 16:59

Does anyone listen to Prime Minister's question time on a Wednesday afternoon?

Prior to answering any questions, the PM offers his sympathy to the family of deceased soldiers killed in action during the week.

His bland utterances leave me cold, I'm afraid. They lack genuine feeling. Do the affected families get any relief from his statements, I wonder? What do you think?


lilybids Report 21 Jun 2008 17:24

dermot i agree he seems to me a very cold fish