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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date


Dionne Report 20 Oct 2007 13:24

Hello Wayne

We didnt think that she did marry Shipton.I know people have looked and their sems no record of a marriage between her and Shipton.
But on her marriage certificate to Arther Knight in the entry Name and surname it says
Dorothea Maud Shipton formally known as Dorothea Maud Sloper.
I do think she lived her life in a story book and made it up as she went along not realising that in later life a very curious grand daughter would come along and research fact from fiction.
As for the famliy of Arhter Knight we know that Arthers son took an instant dislike to Dorothea as to why we dont know but we can guess. he wanted nothing to do with her and was against the marriage of her to his father.His father was 74 and she was 62 at the time of their marriage. I ordered the death certificate thinking he might have been the person to register her death but he turned out to be a friend of Arthers and Dorotheas. She would have only known about Dorotheas life with what ever story Dorothea gave her.
I am wondering if Constance Dorotheas sister was also born in South Africa and their mother was also South African by birth and this is where Dorotheas father met his wife.
It does seem a very complicated process in obtaining a birth certificate from South Africa and I am wondering now if there is really any point.All I would want to know is the name of her mother.

Do you or anyone have any ideas on how I obtain a copy of a will made by Dorothea?

Many thanks again for your time and effort


WayneTracey Report 20 Oct 2007 13:40

Sadly not everyone makes wills, she may not have made one, i would have thought if she did then Arthur's family would have it?
I wonder then was she really born in SA? or did the person registering the death listen to her stories and believe she was actually born in SA?
I have a SA friend i will ask him how someone would go about ordering a SA certificate, i will try and get hold of him today.


WayneTracey Report 20 Oct 2007 13:43

Oh i love the internet...he's calling home now to ask his dad... bless he's been over here too long!


Dionne Report 20 Oct 2007 13:56

LOL Wayne

We do know that she did have a will that is certain. I thought anyone could get copies of wills or has not enough time passed to be able to get a copy.
I thought exactly the same about the birth being in South Africa and stories,lol. But why have we not been able to find a birth registered for her over here then?
Dont you love a good mystery?


WayneTracey Report 20 Oct 2007 13:57


I have called the SA Embassy, you need to download the cert application paperwork from here and then call this number...0906 554 0799, they will make an appointment for you to see them !

Seems a little long winded....!


WayneTracey Report 20 Oct 2007 14:02

Oh i agree it does seem likely she was born there... wonder if she just tried to elongate the romance of being born abroad by saying her son was too? maybe she tried to live her own early years thru her son? maybe her longing for home was greater than the family realised, and she convinced herself she was there longer than she was by perpetrating the lies about your father being born there? or maybe the missing child was indeed born there? in which case she could well have been delusional and confusing him with your father?

oooh yes a good mystery.... well one things for certain without her lies we wouldn't have half a good a story as we have now! this is def one hell of a story to pass on to your family !


Dionne Report 20 Oct 2007 14:02

Thankyou very much Wayne.

My brother is going to London in a week or so I will get him to do this for me. I have a long list for him,lol.


WayneTracey Report 20 Oct 2007 14:03

might want to get him to add Adam/David to the list ??

Maybe the missing birth/death does actually exist aterall?


*~*Chris*~* Report 23 Oct 2007 12:12

Hi just nudging this as I have been reading it with huge interest from the start!!


Dionne Report 23 Oct 2007 14:39

My brother has an appointment with the embassy tomorrow.So fingers crossed we will get a result.


Dionne Report 23 Oct 2007 15:18

Hi Pamela

Thankyou very much for that information. As my brother is limeted for time when he goes to London I will write to obtain a copy of the will.
Watch this space.


WayneTracey Report 24 Oct 2007 17:50


I'm desperate for an did your brother get on at the embassy?


Dionne Report 24 Oct 2007 18:35

Hi Wayne

Im sorry but you will have to wait a little brother went to London but due to time etc he was unable to make it to the Embassy.But he is going up for a few days in the middle of next week.
I have managed to order a copy of my grandmothers will.

I also think my grandmother must have been lieing about her father as I cannot find any information on him what soever.On her marriage certificate to herbert it says fathers name and occupation EDWIN WILLIAM LIVERMORE
Lance Corporal Royal Army medical Corps.Deceased. Dorothea was 21 at time of marriage.
On her second marriage certificate to Arther Knight.Her father is the same name but promoted to Corporal.

I can not find any record of a birth or death for him.I have looked at various Army history sites and find no information on him what so ever.Nothing listed on memorials.

So here is something for you to get your teeth into,tracking down her father,lol



Nicki Report 24 Oct 2007 18:39


Even in this day and age Lance Corporals are referred to as Corporal, so would not read too much into that.

I have been intrigued reading your thread though over the past week, fascinating!!

Good luck.



WayneTracey Report 24 Oct 2007 19:15

Births Jun 1884 (>99%)

Livermore Edwin William Maldon 4a 419


WayneTracey Report 24 Oct 2007 19:17

Marriages Dec 1901 (>99%)

CLARKE Jane Rose Pancras 1b 214
King Edward Watkin A Pancras 1b 214
LIVERMORE Edwin Pancras 1b 214
Phillips Lillie Pancras 1b 214


WayneTracey Report 24 Oct 2007 19:21

i do also remember that she was born in SA, have you tried to find her father through those stationed over there at the time?


Dionne Report 24 Oct 2007 19:32

Oh Wow Wayne Thankyou
Could that really be the birth of Edwin?
It cant be the marriage because if the birth is the correct one he would have only been seven at the time,lol.

As for finding the father in South Africa.
I went to the Royal medical Corps History site and typed his name in the search bar for around the 1900's and absolutely nothing comes up in their records.



WayneTracey Report 24 Oct 2007 19:35

17 at the time??

1884 to 1901 is 17 years?

have you offically reach brain drain? hehehe


Dionne Report 24 Oct 2007 19:43

LOL OH Yye Wayne I have.
After posting the reply I saw my mistake.
Even 17 seems so young to get married.
If these are the parents of Dorothea then what bothers me is why did they go to South Africa? Have two children over there and the children come back to England.
So should I be looking for information on the mother now?
Dorothea never once talked about her mother to my father.I wonder why!!