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Anyone want help with Mysteries THREAD 2**CLOSED**

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date


Christine Report 25 Mar 2006 00:22

i need help with this found my gran and g gran and most of the family but the in 1901 when the last child is born my g gran vanishs and that end up living all over the place hope u can help lily williams 1867 walter 1864 arthur 1887 harold 1889 lily 1884 vernon 1892 walter 1891 walter ends up in a institution on 5th ap 1891 and lily 1867 vanishs


Claire Report 25 Mar 2006 00:30

Hi Zoe!.... Where shall I start?!?... This could get confusing, but I'll do my best to make it as straight forward & simple as possible! I'm looking for the family of Ellen Kennedy who was born abt 1839 according to her marriage certificate, which says she was 26 when she married Arthur Fitzroy Thomposon in Sept 1865. However on the 1871 census says she was born abt 1837. 1881 & 1991 census it says born abt 1835. Also according to death records on line she died Dec quarter 1896 at the age of 61 making her born 1835.... Can marriage certificates be wrong? I'm yet to find any birth records on line so therefore unable to obtain cert. 1871 cenus: Ellen (Kennedy) Thompson 1837 born Pendleton, Lancashire Arthur Fitzroy Thompson 1844 Eccles, Lancashire Frederick Fitzroy Thompson 1866 Pendleton, Lancs Thomas Singleton Thompson 1869 ' ' Address: Ballon Road, Pendleton, Lancashire 1881 census: Ellen Thompson 1835 born Irlam O'th 'Height, Lancs Arthur Fitzroy ' 1844 Eccles, Lancashire Frederick ' ' 1867 Irlam O'th 'Height, Lancs Mary Elizabeth ' 1873 Bury, Lancashire Harry Fitzroy ' 1875 ' ' Addredd: 19 Moorgate & 2 Peter Street (Brunswick Hotel) Bury, Lancashire 1891 census: As above, but address: 29 Poulton Road, Carleton, Lancashire. (I have yet to find Ellen Kennedy (Thompson) before her marriage to Arthur on earlier census') However, here's where it gets complicated!!! On Marriage cert says her fathers name is Thomas Kennedy, can't make out his occupation. The wittness' on cert were Sarah Kennedy & John Singleton. : NOTE: In 1971 census There was a son named Thomas Singleton Thompson born 1969. I guess he must have died somewhere between the 71 & 81 census as there is no further mention of him. Also, Sarah Kennedy I've found a link. I'm guessing Ellens sister. On 1871 Census I found Sarah H Kennedy living as a daughter born abt 1833, Pendleton. Living 301 Ballon Road, Pendleton. (Next door to Ellen & Arthur Thompson) It looks like she's single or unknown & she's a dress Maker. Head of the house & I presume Sarahs mother is Elizabeth Singleton but transcribed as Lingleton, says she's a widow born abt 1813 Eccles, Lancs. She was a grocer & a publician. Also, living there is Cavannah S Kennedy - Granddaughter, single or unknown born abt 1851 in London, and she's a dress maker. In 1881 I found Sarah Hadfield but transcribed as Hatfield Kennedy born 1832 Irlam O'th 'Height. She's the Head, marriage unknown. She's a retired Grocer. She's living with a Mary Hadfield (Hatfield) age 76 abt 1805. born Eccles, Lancs. Says she's a boarder. Marriage unknown & she's a retired schoolmistress. Address 17 Cateaton St. Bury, Lancs 1891 i found Sarah Kennedy (this time transcribed as Kannady) living at 25 Poulton Road, a few doors away from Ellen & Arthur. all other details are same as above. & living with Mary Hadfield In 1901 Sarah was living with Frederick Fitzroy Thompson, Ellen & Arthurs oldest son. It says she is his Aunt. I've not managed to find them in earlier census. How does the Singleton & the Hadfield come into it? What happen to Thomas Kennedy? Who was John Singleton? Was Elizabeth Singleton Ellens mother? Who is Mary Hadfield.? Is Sarah Ellens sister? It's driving me crazy!!!! Can you help??? Any advice of where to go next would be great! Thanks very much, Claire


Malcolm Report 25 Mar 2006 07:14

Hi Zoe, My Grandaunt, Nellie Sullivan Married Henry Bullard on 13 Dec 1903 in Smethwick. The informant at my Great-Grandmother’s death (Sarah Sullivan) on 25 March 1925 was Nellie Knott (daughter) place of death was 94 Ethel Street Smethwick. In 1924 James Knott, Nellie Knott and James Charles Knott were living at 94 Ethel Street Smethwick. In 1925 only James Charles Knott was living there. I haven’t been able to find a death for Henry Bullard or a marriage for Nellie Bullard/Sullivan to Charles Knott between1903 and 1925, can you help? Thanks Malcolm


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 16:04

Elaine So I presume that's solved then? Zoe


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 16:05

Kate Have looked and cannot seem to find her or her father Sorry! Zoe


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 16:33

Christiine This looks like the family from 1901 in 1891 seem to change birth years and places.. Allice Jeffery abt 1885 Exeter, Devon, England Daughter South Brent Devon Sarah W Jeffery abt 1890 Bole, Devon, England Daughter South Brent Devon Susan Jeffery abt 1865 Brixham, Devon, England Wife South Brent Devon Thomas Jeffery abt 1863 Somerset, England Head South Brent Devon William Jeffery abt 1821 Bole, Devon, England Father South Brent Devon William Jeffery abt 1888 Tavistock, Devon, England Son South Brent Devon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Address in 1901 was 15 hawthorne Grove Thomas was a Extension ?Harry? <<have no idea what that is. He may not have been a dock forman in 1901 as she did get married 10 years later so he may have changed jobs. I have also looked for their other childrens births and don't seem to be able to find them!!! I really don't know what to suggest what was the address on the 1st marriage cert for where she lived maybe if they are available you could get a Electoral roll lookup for that address >don't know if any are around for that time but it may help if there is. Zoe


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 16:37

Christine T Could you please post the family in the 1881/1891 census for me with places and years of birth Many thanks Zoe


Christine Report 25 Mar 2006 16:53

Hi Zoe Sorry I know that 1891 entry is not my family as the Sarah has a second initial and I know my Sarah did not have another name. I will try and see if I can get electorial register for when she got married. Thanks for trying Regards Christine


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 17:29

Claire I did find this on IGI Ellen Kenedy Female -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Birth: Pendlebury Christening: 19 JUL 1835 Eccles, Lancashire, England ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Parents: Father: Thomas Kenedy Mother: Elizabeth Kenedy This a a transcribed parish record NOT SUBMITTED on IGI ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Now maybe Elizabeth Singleton is Elizabeth Kenedy Ellen's mother but remarried. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Now here is where the Hadfield comes in SARAH HADFIELD KENNEDY Female -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Christening: 24 MAR 1833 Cathedral, Manchester, Lancashire, England -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: THOMAS KENNEDY Mother: ELIZABETH Transcribed from parish records. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Now Sarah's maiden name maybe Hadfield/Hatfield ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Mary Hatfields birth Mary Hatfield Female -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Birth: Christening: 13 MAY 1804 Eccles, Lancashire, England Death: Burial: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: Joseph Hatfield Mother: Alice ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ What happen to Thomas Kennedy? He may have died need to narrow down with 1841 census Who was John Singleton? This could have been Sarah's brother or maybe stepfather or similar Was Elizabeth Singleton Ellens mother? It seems so from the census and it seems Sarah H is her sister Who is Mary Hadfield.? Maybe this is Elizabeth Singleton c1813 sister! Is Sarah Ellens sister? It does seem like they have the same parents names according to the IGI and are always living close. **************I am Not saying the answers that I gave are correct some research needs to be put in to clarify or dismiss but my answers seem logical based on the info given**************** I think what you need to ask for is a 1841 lookup for Ellen Kennedy b 1835 +/-2 and see if you get a father by the name of Thomas and mother Elizabeth. Try that and get back to me with the details then I will try and find them on following censuses..I don't have access to 1841 or I would have done it Good luck please keep me informed Zoe


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 17:40

Malcolm Where have you looked? H ave you searched through the GRO Marriage & death records for that period. What was Henry Bullards age on the marriage cert? Zoe


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 19:02

Christine which censuses do you have this family on, if you have folio numbers or where they are living that will help? For some reason don't seem to see any of them. When and where did your granddad get married? Zoe


Bernard Report 25 Mar 2006 19:03

Hello Zoe, I have a member of my ancestry who I cannot place. She is Jane Heselton (various spellings) born about 1858. She was living with her grandparents, Matthew and Jane Heselton at Horton in Ribblesdale, born Kettlewell, Yorks, W.R. in 1861 and still with them in 1871. By 1881 she was living at Slatenber, Ingleton, Yorks W.R., a servant with her uncle, Thomas Heselton and his wife. The mystery is who were her parents/parent? In 1881 her place of birth was given as Horton in Ribblesdale (her grandparents were living there). Regards, Kath.


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 19:25

Bernard Ok this is them in 1861 Head is a farmer of 142 acres Ellen Hesleden abt 1852 Horton, Yorkshire, England Daughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Grace Hesleden abt 1850 Horton, Yorkshire, England Daughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Jane Hesleden abt 1810 Giggleswick, Yorkshire, England Wife Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Jane Hesleden abt 1858 Kettlewell, Yorkshire, England Granddaughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Matthew Hesleden abt 1808 Burnsall, Yorkshire, England Head Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Thomas Hesleden abt 1846 Drnclife, Yorkshire, England Son Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1851 Farmer of 88 acres Matthew Heselden abt 1808 Kilnsey, Yorkshire, England Head Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Frances Hesleden abt 1844 Arncliffe, Yorkshire, England Son Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Grace Hesleden abt 1850 Horton, Yorkshire, England Daughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire James Hesleden abt 1842 Arncliffe, Yorkshire, England Son Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Jane Hesleden abt 1811 Giggleswick, Yorkshire, England Wife Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Mary Jane Hesleden abt 1848 Horton, Yorkshire, England Daughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Rebecca Hesleden abt 1839 Arncliffe, Yorkshire, England Daughter Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Thomas Hesleden abt 1846 Arncliffe, Yorkshire, England Son Horton in Ribblesdale Yorkshire Ok couple more children on this ... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ IGI REBECCA HESLEDEN Female -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Christening: 09 DEC 1838 Arncliffe, Yorkshire, England -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: MATTHEW HESLEDEN Mother: JANE There is also a James born 1841 have a look on IGI And do you have the 1841 census of this family as there maybe more children then at least if you have the names of all their children you are closer to knowing who were her parents.. James from the 1851 is a possibility that's presuming it was one of the sons and not a unwed daughter. Cannot see a birth record for her I suppose she never got married as a marriage cert may have given fathers name! Maybe you could get in touch with the parish for the area she was born and see if they have any records of her. Hope this is of some help Zoe


Breezy Report 25 Mar 2006 19:47

Hi Zoe, Trying to find the birth date of George Edward Nichols/Nicholls, to order a cert, Waterbeach Prs show only BAP date, 16 Nov 1845, and Camdex don't show him at all. His parents were Abraham & Sarah Nichols, and the whole family is together in the 1851 cencus, details of which you sent me through the week. Abraham Nichols & Sarah Coxall were married, 26/05/1844, at Waterbeach, question, would a marriage cert be as useful for my records as the birth cert for GG/Gdad George Edward Nichols?


Malcolm Report 25 Mar 2006 20:05

Hi Zoe, Henry Bullard was 53 and Widower in 1903, Nellie was 23 a Spinster (Yes 23) from the marriage certificate. According to the 1901 Census Henry Bullard was a Boarder living with the Sullivan family in Smethwick. His DOB is given as Abt.1848 and Birthplace as Skellingthorpe, Lincolnshire. I have checked Ancestry BMDs (Beta) form 1847-1852 for Henrys birth. I found three in districts, Royston, Sculcoats?, and Lambeth. I’m not sure if any of these are close to Skellingthorpe, Lincolnshire. I did find a death on Free BMDs that may match (Birth 1849 Death 1908) but it was in Royston district. Regards Malcolm


Bernard Report 25 Mar 2006 21:04

Hello Zoe, Thanks for the reply - will have to look at church records, hoping that she was baptised. As my sister would say, 'Was she born the wrong side of the blanket?' Could you please help in finding John Hartley, born Clapham, Yorks. W.R., about 1861. 1881 census, living with his brother Thomas at Rathmell, Yorks w.r., unmarried. We traced Thomas through all the remaining censuses, but John appears to have vanished. Regards, Kath


Claire Report 25 Mar 2006 21:12

Hi Zoe!... Claire again! Wow!... You've found loads of info, a lot of it makes sense. I guess it's a matter of piecing it together bit by bit. Thanks so much, I really appreciate the time & effort you've put into it. You sure you don't mind helping me with this? I've got the details from the 1841 census: The info I've been given is: 1841 Census: Barton upon Irwell & Salford. Thomas Kennedy age 45 Elizabeth Kennedy age 30 Sarah Kennedy age 8 Mary Kennedy age 7 Ellen Kennedy age 6 They were living on North Road, Pendleton, Salford. Says Thomas was a shop keeper & born out of the country. Don't know if this info will help you. It looks a good possibility! No mention of Singletons or Hadfields/ Hatfields though. What do you think? Thanks, Claire

Katie Hartlepool

Katie Hartlepool Report 25 Mar 2006 21:14

I have found a marriage of Alison Simpson Mitchell to Sophus Peter Bahnsen 1891 Hartlepool, Alison was still a mitchell at the time of the census but I can't find Sophus. I cant find them on the 1901 census either but they had a son Francis who was born in Hartlepool in 1892 and died there in 1904?


Jean Report 25 Mar 2006 22:15

Hi Zoe, I am looking for some elusive relatives! Alfred Munn Furby and his wife Alice, cannot find them in 1881, 1891 and 1901. here they are in 1871. Viewing 1-5 of 5 View Record Name Estimated Birth Year Birthplace Relationship Civil Parish County/Island View Image Alfred Munn Furby abt 1849 Bridlington, Yorkshire, England Son St Mary Newington London Alice Winkworth Furby abt 1850 Lambeth, Surrey, England Daughter-in-law St Mary Newington London John Furby abt 1813 Bridlington, Yorkshire, England Head St Mary Newington London Mary Ann Furby abt 1812 Yarmouth, Norfolk, England Wife St Mary Newington London Mary Elizabeth Furby abt 1853 Bridlington, Yorkshire, England Daughter St Mary Newington London Any help you can offer would be much appreciated. Thank you, Jean


Zoe Report 25 Mar 2006 22:37

Malcolm Looking at the Royston one that is in the Cambridge area google Genuki and you will be able to find out about the different area's.. Now have you tried tracing Henry back through the censuses to see if his birthplace is consistant? Zoe